likely the consequence of a multiracial candidate and a white candidate.
Hillary and Bill are more likely to galvanize and unite the conservative republican
base(which includes many racists and sexist. Many of the mega-church conservative evangelicals still teach that women are subservient to men and many of the women accept
this. A good reading is 'The American fascist, The Christian right and the war on America'
by Chris hedges) and bring the republican voters out in droves. Unfortunately, they may
also lose some of the support that obama has garnered with independents and moderate
republicans.
Your point is heard, but don't discount that there are a lot of sexist people and a lot of
republican women who despise hillary.
I've said before that I will support Obama or hillary if they are the nominee. I just don't buy
into the theory that racists will be galvanized.
--- In Dems2008@yahoogroups.com, "azober2000" <azober@...> wrote:
>
> The thing about Hillary (and Bill)is that they've been attacked for so
> long now and nothing has stuck. We don't know if Obama will be able
> to keep up with all the attacks, because he's never been in a race
> this competitive. Personally I think we're long overdue to see a
> black President, but I fear that nominating Obama will energize the
> racists to vote against him in massive numbers. If Obama is our
> nominee, then I'll support him, but I'm very worried about what will
> happen if he gets the nomination.
>
> Aaron
>
>
> --- In Dems2008@yahoogroups.com, "worldpeacesoon" <berts420@> wrote:
> >
> > A valid point, I'm sure fox news will be talking about it more. I am
> also sure that NPR,
> > CNN, The New York Times, NBC, ABC, CBS, etc.....will all be running
> stories why it isn't
> > true and calling the repubs on this one. The swift boaters were not
> even moderately successful.
> >
> > As for independent and moderate voters, if they are voting for Obama
> now, they will most
> > likely vote for him in November. The people that Mr. Romano
> interviewed don't sound very
> > moderate or independent and they surely aren't the independents and
> moderates that have
> > already voted for Obama despite the rumor that has been floating
> around since january of
> > 2007.
> >
> > I would also go back to the voter turnout that Mr Romano failed to
> address. the democrats
> > are turning out 2 to 1 versus the republicans. The conservative
> evangelical base does not
> > support McCain and one of their leaders(dobson), has said he can't
> morally vote for
> > McCain. That could result in many people staying at home or voting
> for a third party
> > candidate(if one should enter).
> >
> > I would imagine that the republicans dirt on both candidates. I
> would also bet that they
> > have more factual information on Hillary(and Bill). The Clintons
> have not released a lot of paperwork,memos, and other information to
> the public yet. george Bush is our president,
> > you don't think he( or Rove and Cheyney) have not looked at those
> papers. i guarantee you
> > they have looked at these documents, and maybe even made copies.
> They will also bring
> > up Bill's business relationship with the Radical Dubai Sheik.
> >
> > In my opinion, Mr Romano article has some valid points that need to
> be thought about,
> > but he doesn't give you all the information to reach a reasonable
> conclusion.
> >
> > --- In Dems2008@yahoogroups.com, "azober2000" <azober@> wrote:
> > >
> > > It doesn't matter whether it's true or not. If it's pushed, Obama
> > > will lose independent and moderate voters out of fear, sadly. And
> > > true it's not being pushed much now, but Obama doesn't have the
> > > nomination yet. If he gets it, I assure you we'll be hearing a lot
> > > more of it. The Republicans didn't swift boat John Kerry until he got
> > > the nomination.
> > >
> > > Aaron
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In Dems2008@yahoogroups.com, "worldpeacesoon" <berts420@> wrote:
> > >
> > > > And finally, these rumors have been debunked, i think the only one
> > > pushing this muslim
> > > > thing anymore is Fox news and this Romano guy and azober2000.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > - In Dems2008@yahoogroups.com, "azober2000" <azober@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> http://www.blog.newsweek.com/blogs/stumper/archive/2008/02/11/obama-s-
> > > > pesky-muslim-problem.aspx
> > > > >
> > > > > Can the Muslim Smear Hurt Obama?*
> > > > > Andrew Romano
> > > > > Barack Obama had a good weekend. For starters, he opened a
> lead of 84
> > > > > pledged delegates and 200,000 popular votes by crushing Hillary
> > > > > Clinton in five** straight contests--Nebraska (68-32 percent),
> > > > > Louisiana (57-36), Washington State (68-31)** and the U.S. Virgin
> > > > > Islands (90-8) on Saturday, followed by a surprisingly sizable
> win in
> > > > > Maine (59-40) on Sunday. He beat Bill Clinton to win best spoken
> > > > > audiobook at yesterday's Grammy Awards. And he had the pleasure of
> > > > > watching as Clinton removed campaign manager Patti Solis Doyle
> (also
> > > > > chief liaison to Latinos) from her team--a sure sign that
> staffers and
> > > > > supporters are worried about Hillary's wobbly bid. The good
> news will
> > > > > probably continue for the next ten days; Obama leads by at
> least 17
> > > > > points in each of Tuesday's Potomac Primary battles (Virginia,
> > > > > Maryland and Washington, D.C.), and is expected to win in liberal,
> > > > > educated Wisconsin and his birth state of Hawaii a week later.
> > > > >
> > > > > All of which got me thinking about the general election. Sure, the
> > > > > Illinois senator is a long way from clinching the Democratic
> > > > > nomination. First he has to survive Ohio and Texas on March 4 and
> > > > > Pennsylvania on April 22--states that are rich in delegates
> and far
> > > > > more favorable to Clinton than February's Obama-friendly
> face-offs.
> > > > > Even then, the fight will probably go all the way to the
> convention in
> > > > > August (the math isn't rocket science). But if Obama does get
> the nod,
> > > > > I'm starting to wonder if he might find it tougher to peel off
> > > > > Republicans than his rhetoric (and the current polling)
> > > > > suggests--especially against John McCain. Reading through the
> comments
> > > > > on "He's One of Us Now," a story I wrote for this week's dead-tree
> > > > > magazine, I was reminded yesterday of a pesky little problem that
> > > > > could hurt him next November: the Muslim rumor.
> > > > >
> > > > > Over the past few months, it's become clear that there are
> some shady
> > > > > people out there bent on spreading the claim----completely,
> > > > > inarguably, demonstrably false--that Obama is a "crypto-Muslim
> > > > > Manchurian candidate." It started with a set of untraceable viral
> > > > > emails, which say that "Barack Hussein Obama has joined the United
> > > > > Church of Christ in an attempt to downplay his Muslim
> background" and
> > > > > ask "Can a good Muslim become a good American?" (the answer,
> they add,
> > > > > is no). And it has continued with trolls like "HolyRoller," a
> > > > > monomaniacal individual now infecting the "He's One of Us Now"
> comment
> > > > > board, where he's busy posing questions like "To all you Obama
> > > > > supporters: Is he Shiite or Sunni?" and lamenting "how foolish
> we have
> > > > > become" now that "a large segment of our population wants one
> of the
> > > > > [Islamic] devils to be their President"--despite the fact that my
> > > > > article had nothing whatsoever to do with Obama's religious
> > > > > background. The Obama campaign has been waging a determined,
> > > > > low-intensity war against the smear since January 2007, and the
> > > > > candidate himself has repeatedly weighed in. His typical response?
> > > > > "The American people are, I think, smarter than folks give
> them credit
> > > > > for."
> > > > >
> > > > > He's mostly right. If Obama wins the Democratic nomination,
> he'll have
> > > > > plenty of time before Election Day to tell voters that he's
> been "a
> > > > > member of the same church, the same Christian church, for
> almost 20
> > > > > years"--enough, I'm sure, to reach all but the most willful bigots
> > > > > (who probably wouldn't vote for him anyway). But what if
> correcting
> > > > > the record isn't the problem? After a few months on the trail, I'm
> > > > > starting to worry that there are swing voters out there concerned
> > > > > about terrorism who won't be willing to "take a risk" on
> someone who
> > > > > has ANY links to the Muslim world--as irrelevant as those
> links may
> > > > > be. Over the past two months, I've had at least a dozen people
> respond
> > > > > to my rote question--What do you think of Barack Obama?--by
> worrying
> > > > > aloud about his "Muslim background." I'm always quick to tell them
> > > > > that he's not a Muslim, but it rarely makes a difference. Take
> Vicki
> > > > > Hercsky, 47, a teacher from Boca Raton, Florida. "Obama, I
> don't even
> > > > > know how he got where he is," she told me after a Rudy
> Giuliani event
> > > > > late last month. "Why do you say that?" I asked. "He's
> Muslim," she
> > > > > replied, matter-of-factly. I stammered. "Well, um, his father was
> > > > > raised Muslim but was an agnostic by the time Barack was born," I
> > > > > said. "Obama is a Christian." Hercsky wasn't swayed. "Yeah,
> but he has
> > > > > it in his blood," she said. "You can't take away what's given
> to you.
> > > > > It's given to you for a reason, and that's who you are. That's
> who he
> > > > > is." I'm not sure what she meant by "it," or "who he is"--and
> I'm not
> > > > > sure I want to know.
> > > > >
> > > > > In a general election battle, the macho, militaristic McCain would
> > > > > make a mighty effort to focus voters' attention on national
> security.
> > > > > He'd contrast his experience--"I've been involved in every major
> > > > > national security issue for the last 20 years, and in some
> ways the
> > > > > last 40," he's fond of saying--with Obama's rather light foreign
> > > > > policy resume. And he'd deploy the phrase "radical Islamic
> extremism"
> > > > > whenever possible. In that kind of contest, Obama doesn't want
> > > > > moderate Republicans--voters he hopes to add to his "coalition for
> > > > > change"--wondering whether he's "an Islamic sympathizer," in
> > > > > HolyRoller's ignorant formulation, or even listening to Rush
> Limbaugh
> > > > > repeat "Hussein" (the senator's middle name) over and over
> again. It's
> > > > > not like national-security voters need to believe that Obama is a
> > > > > practicing Muslim; they just need to suspect that he's not as
> strongly
> > > > > "anti-Muslim" as McCain. I've seen how easy it is to sow those
> seeds
> > > > > of doubt--and how tenaciously they blossom. To decide solely
> on such
> > > > > irrelevant innuendo would be stupid. But people do stupid
> things when
> > > > > they're scared, and after hearing what I've heard on the
> trail, I'm
> > > > > not so sure that some of them wouldn't decide that way regardless.
> > > > >
> > > > > *Changed from "Obama's Pesky 'Muslim' Problem," which was, as
> several
> > > > > commenters have pointed out, a misleading headline. I should've
> > > > > thought longer and harder about the title instead of posting
> the first
> > > > > thing that came to mind. Apologies to all.
> > > > >
> > > > > **Knew I was forgetting something. Thanks to commenter
> Renata29 for
> > > > > pointing out my omission.
> > > > >
> > > > > UPDATE, 5:15 p.m.: Two things in response to the commenters:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1) I'm not working off of Clinton talking points; I'm working
> off of
> > > > > my own experience and reporting on the campaign trail, where I've
> > > > > spoken to dozens of voters over the past few months--and where a
> > > > > surprising number, as I note in the article, brought up what they
> > > > > called Obama's "Muslim background" as a source of concern.
> There's a
> > > > > big difference between speculating about "hypothetical Republican
> > > > > attacks"--which you'll notice I never do--and reporting on
> > > > > conversations you've had with actual Americans whose views of
> the race
> > > > > seem to have been colored by these false, bigoted whispers. The
> > > > > problem exists, and ignoring it won't make it go away.
> > > > >
> > > > > 2) Kenny F writes, "It's not innuendo, it's bigotry.
> Americans are
> > > > > queasy now about openly saying that they won't vote for a black
> > > > > candidate, so this becames a handy stand-in ("It's in his blood??"
> > > > > Yuck). Also, you forget that there is nothing wrong with a Muslim
> > > > > candidate, just like there is nothing wrong with an
> Evangelical one."
> > > > > He's absolutely right--and trust me, I didn't forget. But if
> it wasn't
> > > > > clear from the article, let me make it clear now--there's nothing
> > > > > wrong with a Muslim candidate. The problem is, a lot of Americans
> > > > > (sadly) disagree--and as long as they think Obama's father's
> Muslim
> > > > > childhood somehow makes the Illinois senator suspect--or even just
> > > > > less "anti-Jihadi" than McCain--he may have a problem.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
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